Poll regarding group policy.

[Wolf]

*Edit*
Upon reflection I feel that this group may not be the right one for me - I don't see the rules changing any time soon (and why should they for 1 person's sake ?)

For myself I just don't want to fight other commanders (or should I say I rarely want to - I am bad enough at this game without a real player reminding me of that fact) That shouldn't mean as a result I am barred from certain areas - you're allowing limited PvP into a PvE group ( ) which means it's a PvP group.

You might as well close my account and I will leave the ED group.

Good luck commanders - Thanks for having me for a while

It would make me sad to see you leave, yet your final paragraph reads like you already made up your mind.

I was thinking about replying to your whole post, as I think I found quite a few inconsistencies in the reasoning, but I am not so sure if you are still interested in reading more about why I think the current rules (Which are the original, trust me) are the best.

Let me just ask two last questions: Were you planning to go to warzones often? And would you expect them to be full of human players at all times?

Edit: I just had a thought which might turn this whole argument moot:
Are you under the impression that as a member of this group you have to play in the group at all times?
Being a member of this group does not bind you to it, you know. You can play solo, open, another group, whatever you want while still being a full member. You can be a member of many other groups if you want and play inside this group whenever you feel like it. So even if the warzone rule does not fit your style, you don't have to leave. You will go and look for another warzone group anyway if the rule stays, won't you? That does not prohibit you from playing in this group, you just would stay clear of warzones, as you just don't like this little part.

[Aeryn]

No - haven't gone, though I should as it's clear I made an assumption that PvE meant PvE in all places, didn't think it through and joined up, and now that choice is coming to bite me.

Were you planning to go to warzones often?
And would you expect them to be full of human players at all times?

(1) No, but then again the only warzone I knew of was the one from Alpha. In that you were all (human) playing against the Federation helping the Local team. (IIRC) Then when FD moved to Beta they included the war zone and I only knew of it's location after I read about it on the forum. (Eranin 2 ?) Even in B3 I have no idea if there are war zones or more importantly where they are ... That's the thrill of it - drop out of SC into a place not knowing where you are or what you will find .. arrive in the middle of a HUGE battle, ooh .. my team verses the enemy .. and BAM! Player kills you ...

(2) Not at all, as space is big .. You're not likely to meet another player unless you group up deliberately. If my friend and I decided to visit a war zone (if I knew where they were) for a bit of heavy PvNPC action it would spoil it somewhat if a random jumped in and ganked us "because they were allowed".

I really wish I could show you my piloting skills .. I think you would appreciate the situation : Plenty of people on the official forums complain that NPCs are too easy - I snort at that - takes me 10 minutes to kill one and that's if I am lucky.

You can play solo, open, another group, whatever you want while still being a full member.

The same could be said for someone wanting to enter a warzone .. You can play open too if you want PvP as I thought that was the point of it. There if you're turned on by another player even though you're on the same side wouldn't the other NPCs / Players then see that clown as an aggressor ? It happened in the tutorials (the one where 2 fleets warp in - stray shot - say goodnight!)

My original understanding was that if you entered a warzone on your own (in the PvE group) how cool would it be for a total stranger to randomly warp in and help you ... turn the odds and all that ? That is what I wanted from ED : cooperative game play, but if I have to resort to solo / new group it's not going to happen. (This reminds me of the old arguement on the forum between the PvP players and PvE where we were told to play solo / group because you consent to PvP in open ... thought that's why you created this group as you were all PvE players ... You do see the confusion don't you ?)

--

**Edit:

Wanted to add that I have been enjoying the game in the PvE group .. Actually saw a few commanders the other day and one of them hailed me and said hello! It's nice seeing plenty of people around the stations and you know you're safe from them and the only bad things that will happen are your own undoing. (Wanted / Bounties / Stolen Goods)

I think I understand now where the confusion has come from. Take this mission statement:

This group is for those who want to play Elite and enjoy what the game has to offer without having to worry about other players spoiling your game. There are no leaders in this group and you will never be told how to play or that you should be doing something for the greater good of the group. You create your own destiny by being who you want to be not how others want you to be.

That is as far as I read ... thought "Yes!" ... This is for me .. I want to play ED without worrying about other players.

If I am honest I think I failed to read the entire post .. the next lines down say "the only place PvP is allowed ..."

"Caveat emptor" springs to mind and, hands in the air, Guilty.

[Wolf]

My original understanding was that if you entered a warzone on your own (in the PvE group) how cool would it be for a total stranger to randomly warp in and help you ... turn the odds and all that ? That is what I wanted from ED : cooperative game play, but if I have to resort to solo / new group it's not going to happen. (This reminds me of the old arguement on the forum between the PvP players and PvE where we were told to play solo / group because you consent to PvP in open ... thought that's why you created this group as you were all PvE players ... You do see the confusion don't you ?)

I totally get you.
My reasons for joining this group are probably closer to yours than you think.
The rules are formulated a little vague at the moment but rest assured, they of course mean:
PvP is forbidden. Only exception is players on opposing factions in warzones. No teamkilling, no backstabbing.
Violations will be dealt with by Mobius himself!

[Wolf]

Oh. And it mostly happens like you imagine anyway. People usually join the same side and help.
It would just be better if we don't take away choice in this.

[Rune]

That's the thrill of it - drop out of SC into a place not knowing where you are or what you will find .. arrive in the middle of a HUGE battle, ooh .. my team verses the enemy .. and BAM! Player kills you ...

That's the thing though, you don't just emerge in a conflict zone unaware, they show up on your map when you get close to them. Personally if I do decide to head to any I'll try and arrange to get some other players to join me either via here or Team Speak and do some co-op team work.

I wouldn't mind occasionally going up against other human players in them as it'll be a more unpredictable experience than against AI and reckon I'd probably learn more pilot skills wise as well, I understand your view of go to open for that, however I'd rather not deal with the neutrals or players on the same side opening fire on me.

I trust people in this group to act with honour in conflict zones (or get booted out quick enough), I've got no faith in that with open.

[Mr_Average]

Good luck figuring out the results.

[Cmdr Kharma]

That's the thing though, you don't just emerge in a conflict zone unaware, they show up on your map when you get close to them.

Accrington Stanley..........

[LtCasey]

I answered this poll, with clan/squadron rules in my mind.

At the Moment, I see Elite as an absolute Coop-dreamland-universe, like I did in my younger days.
Erm, quiet a while ago.

IF I want to go on pvp I would join Open Play.

[Epsilon]

Hi, I'm new!

Just wanted to weigh in on this, since it's about 103% of the reason I joined the group.

tl;dr (and non-qualified) version: everything else in the poll isn't opt-in, but combat zones are. Who cares who's on the other side of the guns if everyone agrees to get into a fight?

The difference between most of the options (and IMHO, the spirit of the group) and the one about permitting PvP in a combat zone is targeting and choice. Opt-in, if you will.

Someone attempting to interdict you is specifically targeting you, and you don't have an option to opt out.

Someone hunting you down because they took a mission out on you or see that you've got a nice chunky bounty is also targeting you, and you don't have an option to opt out.

Someone who happens to join the other side of a "free for all" or a "furball" or whatever they're called? No malice or targeting of the other players - just "hey, I want a fight."

If everyone involved wants a fight, what's the difference whether it's a player or an NPC that's behind the guns? If we're worried about differences in skill/loadout, perhaps the group's rule could read "In a combat zone situation where PvP happens, do not attack fleeing players" and define fleeing as someone that's... I dunno, below 50% hull and seems to be attempting to GTFO with a quickness.

Full disclosure: I don't like PvP, and I'm not overly fond of fighting in general. I'm the type that's going to be doing trading/exploring. I have done PK in the distant past though, and it was fun when it wasn't a pissing contest and was all in good fun.

[Deyn]

I would absolutely agree that in general THIS specific group had a creed of player vs environment... as another player is not part of the environment he is no valid target! I seem to have made a wrong click in the poll, but where would you draw the line? If an inexperienced player enters a warzone and some 10 players wait for him as it is "ok" to go PvP in a warzone, is that ok?
What about the 100.000 cr bounty? Is it ok to kill a CMDR with a 999.999 cr bounty? It is just 1 credit...
PvE in my point of view stands for Co-operative play! No humans killing other humans proving how good they are at fighting.
I agree the AI is enough of a challenge. And they interdict everybody if reasonable or not damaging ships, make you mess up a mission ending up with stolen goods etc.
So I really would pass on any PvP action. A human player should always be considered a friend! No danger!