Reinforced Bulkheads & HRPs - Why?

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Roger Wilco Jr
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Reinforced Bulkheads & HRPs - Why?

Postby Roger Wilco Jr » Sun Jan 03, 2016 3:47 pm

I'm a big fan of strong shields and energy weapons. I never used upgraded bulkheads until I saw a Vulture build Flip did and I thought they sounded cool. I didn't notice much of difference in the Vulture. Partly because it is so maneuverable, and partly because I run if I lose shields. I finally learned about power management and how to use SCBs with the Vulture, and now I think SCBs are mandatory if you want to stick around in a RES and make money.

When I upgraded to the Python, I had the strongest shields, big pulse lasers than can keep firing forever, and SCBs for when I start losing shields. I had great results with this setup. I could often go for an hour in a HazRes w/o needing to fire off an SCB. Then one day I thought to add military grade composites. The next time I went out I could barely turn and was getting pounded. I limped back to the station, went back to light weight alloys, and everything was back to normal.

Since then, I've never upgraded bulkheads, and I've never used hull reinforcement packages. In the Python and Anaconda, I can stay in a HazRes until I get tired and never lose shields. I think they turn just fine. I do use SCBs, but I could just as easily run away and let them recharge with time, but using SCBs means more credits per hour. On the rare occasion I do lose my shields, I turn and burn for the nearest station, as I've usually taken some hull damage.

So I'm reading these load out and configuration threads about various ships. There seem to be a lot of complaints about how badly some ships turn. But then I look and there are invariably heavier bulkheads and hull reinforcement packages added, and I wonder why? Do you hang around after losing shields and let your armor get pounded? Do you not notice better maneuverability without the heavier bulkheads and armor? I could see using them in some critical mission where you had to stick around until all the enemies are dead, but I don't think they have those situations in this game. Or, do you add all this armor, have a hard time turning and staying on target, and then run when you lose shields anyway?

And on a related note, if you have been using the bi-weave shields, how do the C-rated bi-weaves compare to A-rated standard shields? Do you lose shields more often? Do they regenerate so fast that you can stick around, as long as you have stronger armor to absorb some damage while they are regenerating? They never sounded like something I wanted to try, and never even bothered - even in the beta.
It's time to give this another go.

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Re: Reinforced Bulkheads & HRPs - Why?

Postby DustKart » Sun Jan 03, 2016 3:56 pm

I've just been using the bi-weave on my Vulture in a high conflict in Exioce. I thought they did well. They recharged much quicker giving you the option to stay fighting.
Spent 30 mins there and got no damage. I'm keeping them.
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Re: Reinforced Bulkheads & HRPs - Why?

Postby FryGuy » Sun Jan 03, 2016 4:57 pm

Only thing I've found them useful on so far is the FAS. The shield class in that doesn't really support it's mass, and therefore drops really fast, regardless of what type you have, so the other solution is to just add more mass and armor. The hull on them can take a beating, and by increasing the mass with HRPs, you can turn it into a battering ram of death. Boosting into pirates in smaller ships who are scanning their victims in HazRes sites results in their untimely demise, with hardly a dent on the FAS.

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Re: Reinforced Bulkheads & HRPs - Why?

Postby Tifu » Sun Jan 03, 2016 5:24 pm

I've also read reports on the ED boards that people are running into significant overheat problems with SCB's on the Viper mk4. This ship can mount a hefty 4 slot shield so my guess is that the amount of SCB capacity you need to replenish it is quite high (leading to heat problems).

Played around with the posted config - by replacing the 4A SCB with a 4D HRP you boost hull strength to 600 points. 700 points with a reinforced hull and nearly 900 with military composites.

I've seen several videos where a Viper mk4 either maims or vaporizes another ship by ramming into them. Even a larger ship will be in trouble if it barrels in at 350k+ with all that armor and shielding.

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Re: Reinforced Bulkheads & HRPs - Why?

Postby CMDR Abil Midena » Sun Jan 03, 2016 7:02 pm

Roger Wilco Jr wrote:... Partly because it is so maneuverable, and partly because I run if I lose shields. ... On the rare occasion I do lose my shields, I turn and burn for the nearest station, as I've usually taken some hull damage...


I thought the same thing until 2.0. I was in a 'distress call', and got to the point where it was me vs a conda and vulture. I was attacking the conda, and could see that I was going to lose shields with the Vulture hammering as I was focused on the conda, so I ran just before my shields fell. I got out with 55% hull.

After that, I realized that your shields will drop much faster in 2.0, either due to a shield tweak, better AI, or better weaps on the AI, or all of the above.

I added Mil hull and 2 HRP's. I still worry if my shields go, since the AI can still inadvertently get your thrusters or PP. But I don't worry as much.

That's why I added the mil hull and 2 hrp's.

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Re: Reinforced Bulkheads & HRPs - Why?

Postby Roger Wilco Jr » Sun Jan 03, 2016 7:14 pm

I forgot about ramming. I don't find it very sporting. Saw some guy giggling while ramming in a youtube video and I just wanted to punch him in the face. With that said, I will occasionally ram as a coup de grace. I can see where having a lot of mass would help there, but it seems that the commanders I'm asking about don't ram as a primary weapon.

I haven't done much combat since Horizons, but my shields did seem to be dropping a lot faster. I thought it might be because I was rusty.
It's time to give this another go.

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Re: Reinforced Bulkheads & HRPs - Why?

Postby Cmdr Kharma » Sun Jan 03, 2016 7:36 pm

Roger Wilco Jr wrote:I haven't done much combat since Horizons, but my shields did seem to be dropping a lot faster. I thought it might be because I was rusty.


Yep me too......No real combat in 2.0 till tonight....

Asp.....2 x shield boosters and Mil bulks....

Got taken out tonight by a master Vulture using Plasmas.......

2 x shots took shields......I x took power plant......

I thought I had him as well......

Never been taken out by one before........Not even Elite ones......

:(
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Re: Reinforced Bulkheads & HRPs - Why?

Postby Flip » Sun Jan 03, 2016 11:31 pm

It’s always satisfying to give the coup de grace by ramming. But it has to be a “smart" ramming, with the minimum of speed and distance. Victoria is expert at that and made some awesome screenshots, that way. :)
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Re: Reinforced Bulkheads & HRPs - Why?

Postby Roger Wilco Jr » Mon Jan 04, 2016 12:51 am

Well, just for giggles, I tried a shieldless Vulture in a RES. The results were very surprising - initially. After about 1/2 hour taking on singles, I only had a few percent loss of hull. But with those C3 beams, I spent a lot of time waiting for the weapons cap to recharge and did take some module heat damage. While tailing Clippers, their turret beams would more or less bounce off the mirrored armor. The problem came with wings, where whoever you weren't shooting at, were shooting at you. So the first wing, a Dropship and a couple of Eagles, got me down to 81% hull, and my beams were failing. Still, that was only about 15k in damages.

Then I tried it again with E3 pulses. Overall they may have been slower to kill enemies, but there was no heat damage and very little waiting for the weapons cap to recharge. Again, I went about 1/2 hour w/o a scratch. Then I took on a wing of a Clipper and two Eagles. This time they got me down to 83% hull and a cracked canopy. Only 6k in damages, but I couldn't hang around.

It'd been months since I'd been in a Vulture, but I didn't really notice any loss of maneuverability with all the extra armor (as compared to the Python). I was really surprised by how well the Vulture could hold its own. It was also nice not worrying about power management, or pips - just kept 2 in engines and 4 in weapons. But when you take module damage that takes out your guns and canopy, with still more than 80% hull remaining, that's just not acceptable.

I think I'll stick with the strongest shields I can fit, use SCBs to hang around longer, and leave the heavy armor at the station.
It's time to give this another go.

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Re: Reinforced Bulkheads & HRPs - Why?

Postby kappamerc » Mon Jan 04, 2016 1:23 am

Regarding the SCBs and overheating, I think they made it so that if you wanna use SCBs you also need to have a heatsink.

Have not tried the normal A class shields on the Vulture so I cannot compare but the bi-weave seems to do well on this ship size.


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