Windows needs more memory...

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CMDR DancingLemur
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Re: Windows needs more memory...

Postby CMDR DancingLemur » Thu Mar 03, 2016 3:58 pm

Maybe there's a simple solution for your problem.

http://www.tomshardware.co.uk/forum/840 ... age/page-2

Try to disable the windows service (Windows Network Data Usage Monitoring Driver service) mentioned in the provided link and don't forget to restart PC after it. Also if u have Killer network card (I have) the bundled software could cause the leak too - again mentioned in the link above. Uninstall and download only the newest drivers. Install them via device manager as there is no *.exe.

I had similar problem few days ago as I started playing MWO. After five or six matches my RAM usage jumped up to 97% (I have 12GB in my rig) and remained there even after quitting the game. Firstly I suspected the game itself, but in the end, i managed to solve my memory leakage by those procedures.

Hope this helps

Fly safe. o7
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Re: Windows needs more memory...

Postby Loriath » Thu Mar 03, 2016 4:55 pm

My experience (been a system admin since the 80's) tells me that no page file, even with vast amounts of Ram is not a good thing. Windows is designed to use the Pagefile, and in my experience, will become unstable if it is not used. I think its due to bad coding personally, but that is my opinion. I have seen Windows 7 machines with 32 GB's ram choke almost to death when really pushed with no pagefile. As much as I would love to turn it off, I leave it on just to be safe.

Every modern OS uses some sort of pagefile/swap file. Linux, Unix, OSX, and Windows. And because they rely on its ability to swap in and out of memory as needed. Some may find there system runs just fine without a pagefile, as others in this thread have said, but there are so many system variables because of the number of different hardware components that can be mixed and matched that it may be a crutch for the OS. Your combination of hardware may have issues, mine may not. If you run without and have no issues, congrats. If you have it disabled and have issues, its worth trying with it on and see what happens.

All the System Memory you can afford is the best answer to any question about speeding up a machine. Always has been (I remember when 4X 4MB simms cost me over $1500 US). SSD is almost even with that now because of the dramatic price drops.

Now, when can we get GDDR10 SSD's to go with our GDDR10 ram and GDDR20 Graphics memory? :)
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Re: Windows needs more memory...

Postby StaticRadion » Fri Mar 04, 2016 1:16 am

Loriath wrote:My experience (been a system admin since the 80's) tells me that no page file, even with vast amounts of Ram is not a good thing. Windows is designed to use the Pagefile, and in my experience, will become unstable if it is not used. I think its due to bad coding personally, but that is my opinion. I have seen Windows 7 machines with 32 GB's ram choke almost to death when really pushed with no pagefile. As much as I would love to turn it off, I leave it on just to be safe.

Yup, this LOL. I think the major problem is that some programs are coded to take advantage of paging for more than a errant crash dump and because you don't really know what a program is going to do till you are hands on with it. Most people build or buy systems and then use them for a number of years without doing any type of routine maintenance. They will read something about the paging when they first get their pc and turn it off because an expert on the internet told them it was ok to do so. Their system will be stable for a year before they download and install a new program or game that uses paging and will go crazy trying to find out what is wrong with their computer when it becomes unstable.

The one guy I mentioned who had a good explanation of not having a page file and defending its removal was systems admin building a workstation that was limited to running an OS and three programs. Closed system with controlled updates, a fixed lifespan, and dedicated superuser means you can probably do what others can't.

Anyways I guess it does not really matter as long as I have found at least one other person that understands. Thanks Loriath o7
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Re: Windows needs more memory...

Postby thebs » Thu Apr 21, 2016 1:22 am

Loriath wrote: ... Every modern OS uses some sort of pagefile/swap file. Linux, Unix, OSX, and Windows. And because they rely on its ability to swap in and out of memory as needed ... Some may find there system runs just fine without a pagefile, as others in this thread have said,
Yes, every OS should have a paging location (e.g., file, partition, etc...). But how aggressive does the OS use it?

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Loriath wrote:but there are so many system variables because of the number of different hardware components that can be mixed and matched that it may be a crutch for the OS.
Er, um, what? What's system hardware have to do with memory?

At most, GPU is the only thing, because GPU's act like CPUs and use Direct, in-Memory Execution (DiME). So yes, if you fill 3-4GiB of memory with 10-16GiB of compressed textures and various, added buffers necessary for the GPU, yeah, you're going to be down 3-4GiB. But that's about the only issue.

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I think what you might be doing is confusing two things ...

Loriath wrote:Your combination of hardware may have issues,
The platform-processing addressing-paging -- windowing memory (to memory) -- with virtual memory paging - windowing memory (to secondary storage). The two are wholly unrelated and have nothing to do with swap space at all. None at all.

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Loriath wrote:mine may not. If you run without and have no issues, congrats. If you have it disabled and have issues, its worth trying with it on and see what happens.
All the System Memory you can afford is the best answer to any question about speeding up a machine.
I'd argue one needs to tune it, especially in OSes that go the other way, they are aggressive in buffering and caching (e.g., Linux).

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Loriath wrote:Always has been (I remember when 4X 4MB simms cost me over $1500 US). SSD is almost even with that now because of the dramatic price drops.
Memory prices can increase due to over-supply and resulting under-production years later.

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Loriath wrote:Now, when can we get GDDR10 SSD's to go with our GDDR10 ram and GDDR20 Graphics memory? :)
We'll never likely get dual-ported (Graphics) DRAM for main system memory without some drastic changes to the PC architecture. And DRAM is never likely to be an effective SSD, other than for very short-term storage.

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Last edited by thebs on Thu Apr 21, 2016 1:29 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Windows needs more memory...

Postby thebs » Thu Apr 21, 2016 1:28 am

StaticRadion wrote:Yup, this LOL. I think the major problem is that some programs are coded to take advantage of paging for more than a errant crash dump and because you don't really know what a program is going to do till you are hands on with it.
Not to nitpick, but I think you mean the OS, or select drivers, enabled by the OS. Programs themselves don't use swap for temporary/persistent storage, although developers may assume that's going to be the store (although that, in itself, is not a good assumption to be made by developers).
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Re: Windows needs more memory...

Postby GlobusDiablo » Thu Apr 21, 2016 1:36 am

thebs wrote:...


I tried, but all of that went woosh past and above my head. :) But it's nice to know someone knows what's going on. ;)

On a side note, I've only ever had the issue when playing E: D exlusively on planets. So I'm assuming it's related to lack of ram somewhere. Graphics or main.

I haven't been playing much recently. Saving up for a new system (and VR - haven't decided which brand yet), and I'll make darn sure ram won't be in short supply then. :)

Fly safe
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Re: Windows needs more memory...

Postby thebs » Thu Apr 21, 2016 2:21 am

GlobusDiablo wrote:
thebs wrote:...

I tried, but all of that went woosh past and above my head. :) But it's nice to know someone knows what's going on. ;)
Let me put it this way ...

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We're almost at that point in the new age of 64-bit PC Gaming now, almost a decade later, 16GiB+ RAM usage.

Those various settings can result in insane I/O and even the resulting interconnect wait. Heck, Bethesda was chronic fail with their I/O in Fallout 4 -- even on the PC with lots of memory (inexcusable) -- basically requiring a NAND storage device to feed it well. Wholly unnecessary!

GlobusDiablo wrote:[On a side note, I've only ever had the issue when playing E: D exlusively on planets. So I'm assuming it's related to lack of ram somewhere. Graphics or main.
Adoption of OpenGL v3 (no small feat, with lots of consequences), insane textures and rendering ...

E:D 2.x in 2015 is basically the equivalent of Quake in 1995.

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GlobusDiablo wrote:I haven't been playing much recently. Saving up for a new system (and VR - haven't decided which brand yet), and I'll make darn sure ram won't be in short supply then. :) Fly safe
The great thing about waiting on SkyLake is that DDR4 has come down in price since last year, and will continue to close in on DDR3.

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BTW, don't forget a cheap, $50-60, 240-256GB NAND SSD can work wonders!

I install Windows 7 x64 in a 128GiB C: drive on that 240GB (384GiB on my 1TB 2.5" NAND -- remember, undercommit for longevity), then my platters are D: drive. Steam goes on D: (platters), but I also setup, in Steam (yes, read up on "Locations"/"Install Folders"), the directory C:\SteamSSD (NAND), so I can install games to it as well (just pull down the location).**

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