hot Wings

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hot Wings

Postby M00N-WATCHER » Tue Mar 02, 2021 7:34 am

I hear one of the most lucrative ways to make credits is by joining a "wing"? Is that like a squadron? Going around bounty hunting or pirating?

Any Wings here?
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Re: hot Wings

Postby Zetr0 » Tue Mar 02, 2021 10:31 am

Greetings Commander Moon-Watcher -o7-

Welcome to the Mobius Sector

There are a few avenues to make money within the Milky Way, one of these ways is with the use of Wing Missions, there are various types but I will try and give you a low down in a moment.

Firstly add me to your in-game friends list CMDR "ZETERON" once you have that whenever we play in the same game mode "Open or Mobius PVE *private group" we can WING up

You will need to add a Commander to your in game SOCIAL friends list before you can invite them to a Wing.
( you do this from the communication tab - on the PC you press "2" cycle the panels to Social and then select the commander to send a Wing Request )

A Wing can only have 4 members at a time ( thats you and three others ) -

You can join a Wing from an invite from another commander or invite other commnaders to form a Wing to for a Wing with you. (again you do this from the communications panel - social tab)

There is no direct "Commnader in charge" of the Wing - you are all equal and if you need a Wing Commander you as a group can decide - there is no in-game bonus or position.

Please note, as much as the in-communication system is amazingly immersive with its bells, pops, squeaks and whistles - its absolutley useless in conveying information - you can barely comprehend what the other Commander is saying.

I often use, and would humbly recommend Discord for this, you can start your own or join an established channel and share that with your new Wing Mates. trust me this will save a lot of frustration and confusion down the line.



A bit about Squadrons -
Squadrons are not the same, you can be part of the squardon and not part of the wing, or be in a different wing. Squadrons are static entity when you join them and persist when you "log-off" - by contrast WING's are instance based and if you log-off or go into another mode of play ( Open, Solo or another Private Group ) you leave the WING.

Squads by contrast can have as many Commanders as they want and they are often ranked by the Squads administration. Squads can perform Large Scale Community Goals and Commander ( player run ) BGS ( Back Grould Similation : RE: Power Play )

At this point I will say, sign up to INARA - its free!!! now while it might be a bit overwhelimg at first - I promise you wont regret it - the more you use it the better and richer your game will be.

When you find your way around the site you can add me again Commander Zetr0 - just see the tag at the end of this post.


So, thats the primer - lets talk about the Credits....
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Re: hot Wings

Postby Zetr0 » Tue Mar 02, 2021 11:13 am

Making Money in a Wing ( Part 1 - Commodities Sourcing and Transporting )

There are several approaches and these often get "manipulated" by "FDev" when they have a slow Wednesday IMHO - so these options will likely change over time but for now ( 33070302 ) the following can be quite profitable.

Wing Missions - Commodity Sourcing
These are often "Industry needs XXXX" and you purchase the goods to deliver - the idea behind these is to share the costs and the amount of commodites required for them - Payouts are WING wide so if there is a payout of $20,000,000 credits all members of the WING get $20,000,000 irrespective of if they put anything in or not.

Remember not all members would be "Hauling" goods - some might be vanguard with weapons ready to fight the pirate menace.

Look closely at the commodity required, its cost to buy them, and see if thats a cost you are willing to invest in as an individual or as a group. as a final note on this I will leave this tip... not all minerals need to be mined - remember that Commander - it will pay dividends down the line.

A big friend for these missions is the most excellent tool - Find Commodity Tool from eddb.io - so much useful stuff here, well worth your time investing in learning to use this.

You can share a missions whenever you want - you don't have to do it at the start you can do it at the end before you "complete the mission", you can log out come back to it the next day and its still there, you will have to create / join another wing if you want to share it.

You can only share 1 Wing Mission at a time, for each Wing Member ( a total of four Wing Missions can be SHARE ACTIVE at a time )

please note you can take more more WING missions but only SHARE one at a time - however you can fill some yourself too and then Share Later to Cash In.

Remember : Payouts for these missions are dependent on your Trade Rank and Reputation with the Faction offering the Contract

In this reguard there are a lot of Commodity Sourcing WING Missions that I can solo with my engineered vessels I stack the payouts and usuaully share them with my Play Group on Wednesdays and or Sundays, or through the week with new or struggling players - payouts vary as the missions I get and take, but during the week ( if you are in the GCRV 1568 System ) there between $50,000,000 to $200,000,000.

These are always complete and just ready to cash in - all you as a Wing Commander would be to accept the mission ( in the transaction menu ) and once I press completely you will then get a message of where to "cash - in" that mission for the credits - you will have 30 days from that point to cash it in. at that point you can then accept another shared mission from that Wing Commander.

I was able to stack a total of 20 Wing Commodity Missions just over a week ago for a Payout of $959,000.000 credits for each Wing Member - my Wing mates also had Wing Cash-In around the $450,000,000 to $750,000,000

Yes that is over $2.1 Billion Payout - that was a particular good day - bought my Fleet Carrier "The Pax Magellanc"


Wing Mission - Boom Time Deliveries
Like the above but the sourcing has already been done and all you need to do is truck the haul of commodites to what ever the star system they need it in. Payouts are a lot lower compared to the sourcing - FDev decided this was something they wanted to f*... fiddle with and to me this is now massively broken in terms of payouts.

Note how much of the Commodity you need to ship and how many runs you and or your group need to do to complete the missions.

Boom Time Delivery Penalties
These are the only missions to really have a hard financial screw over - if you lose just 1 of the commodites shipment - say an enemy's hatchbreaker limpet managed to steal one cansister of cargo - you will fail the mission... as the missions commodity is "unique" and cannot be replaced - so if you art carting 2500 tons of Silver from one system to another and lose 1 of these - they cannot be replaced by buying a lump of silver in a nearby system or station.

Penalties can be quiet harsh - in the above case you could get a "partial" payout that is substantially less, also if you lose a load due to being attacked and killed ( and you will be interdicted prepare for that ) - you can lose even the partial payment and be fined for the loss of goods to a significant market value of the goods on top of the loss of your ship- remember that - because that can cripple your opertating funds and your rebuy.

Fortunately I am in a position to not have to do those missions, as mentioned before - the amount of commodities that are need to shift ( i.e. the number of runs required to the payout are not worth the time - there are better methods - like commodity sourcing missions above - while that does require an oppertating cost *buying the commodity* if you lose a load your not crippled in payout because iof it. )


Next.... Combat Missions
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Re: hot Wings

Postby Zetr0 » Tue Mar 02, 2021 12:30 pm

Making Money in a Wing ( Part 2 - Wing Combat )

There are several approaches and these often get "manipulated" by "FDev" when they have a slow Wednesday IMHO - so these options will likely change over time but for now ( 33070302 ) the following can be quite profitable.

Wing Missions - Pirate Massacre
Right so you probably heard many stories around the Pilots Lounges and Terrainian Bars about scanderlous payouts for very little effort. When the hunting of criminals can provide you a future and carreer within the Milky Way...

Short Answer, yes there is money to be had here, but if you do not have an Engineered Ship, with Engineered Weapons and Shields - this wont come easy, even in a Wing.

So Commander, let me explain how to get the most out of these "contracts"

________________________________________________________________

Basic Method
You take WING Pirate Massacre Missions but only ONE from each faction - that is wanting the same thing say Massacre Pikum Family Pirates.

Now each Pikum Family Pirate that you kill will tally for all the faction contracts that you have. e.g.

$22,000,000 - Silver Bridge PLC : Massacre 35 Pikum Family Pirates
$16,000,000 - GCRV Law Party : Massacre 25 Pikum Family Pirates
$10,000,000 - GCRV Focus : Massacre 12 Pikum Family Pirates
$14,000,000 - Aseveljet : Massacre 20 Pikum Family Pirates


With the above list every Pirate I kill I get a kill tallied against each of the contracts above - so if I kill 35 Pirates I will complete ALL of the contracts - as kills are applied concurrently

Now.... lets say you Wing up but DO NOT SHARE THE MISSION yet. Your Wing man tags your kills - this will also count as an additional kill - so you both Kill the same Target - this counts as 2 Kills to each of the contracts running concurrently - extrapolate for 4 Wing Commanders each attacking the same target will equal 4 kills, even though it is technically one Kill -

As you can see you can get through even a Large Pirate Massacres very quickly with 3 or more in a WING as -

EACH WING ASSIST KILL COUNTS AS A FURTHER KILL - Multiple Wing Assist's equals Multiple Kills from one Target

However Once you SHARE the mission, and other commander accept it - Wing assist Kills Do not count for that contract *or other contracts as the shared one take precidence* - this is why you share after completion - again - ask FDev, or don't ;)


Advancing the Method
Now with that in mind, lets assume in the above example you and two Wing mates have similar Missions, the thing to look for here is the Highest Target "35 Pirates from Silver Bridge PLC" - so you, and your Wing Mates, can pad out further massacre missions to total 35 Targets from all the other factions. even taking personal Non-Wing massacre missions as these will count as extra money for you - If you gotta kill 35 Pirates... might as well make each one count... several times over ;).

$22,000,000 - Silver Bridge PLC : Massacre 35 Pikum Family Pirates
$16,000,000 - GCRV Law Party : Massacre 25 Pikum Family Pirates
$10,000,000 - GCRV Focus : Massacre 12 Pikum Family Pirates
    $14,000,000 - GCRV Focus : Massacre 20 Pikum Family Pirates
$14,000,000 - Aseveljet : Massacre 20 Pikum Family Pirates


So in the above instance after the mission board refreshed I grabbed a 20 target Massacre mission from GCRV Focus for $14,000,000 - I would be able to complete this as the total is 32 Pirates from "GCRV Focus" - these contracts will run consecutively - I beleive in order of when you collected them.

So for killing 35 Pikum Family Pirates I will receive $76,000,000 Credits - Since I am tagging Kills with a Single Wingman, it is effectively only 17 Pirates - If I was tagging kills with 4 fellow Wing Commanders I would only have to kill 9 Pirates - for £76 Million - I will say tagging kills requires some communication and cordination as in the fray of battle some potential tagged kills will likely be lost.

Now lets say I get back to Cernan Dock with my most awesome best buddy Wing Man "Dubious Dan", we both share out our missions before we cash them in - "Double D's" has a collective of $50,000,000 credits in Wing Missions to Cash in and I have $76,000,000 - However before we start our new friend "Uncle Bob" joined us a bit late and we invite him to Wing - they have $40,000,000 to cash in from yesterday - so he shares these with us and we share ours - that means for what is about 40 minutes worth of "effort" equals each Commander Receiving $166,000,000 Credits.

- Oh, wow, I nearly forgot - There is Extra Money
If you or one of your Wing ( while killing Wanted Pirates ) has a Kill warrent Scanner bound to their "pew pew" button you will get extra bounties - on average (for me) for 35 Pirates its about $15,000,000 more credits - this is for each player that was in the Wing with the Kill.

You may need to ( most likely have to ) travel to an Interstellar Factors to "cash in some of the bounties - please note that you will get more money cashing in the system that the bounty was issued - in the above example I cash in my bounties at the station I got the missions with, Cernan Dock (GCRV 1568) - jump to PIKUM and then lay the law down on pirates - cash in the bounties at the interstellar Factors at Rushworth Station that are to far away to bother with - and before I hand in the missions back at Cernan Dock ( GCRV-1568 ) I cash in what ever bounties I have at the Authority Contact

Remeber -
Contracts from the same faction run consecutively ( one after the other )
Contracts from different factions run concurrently ( in paralell *at the same time )


So thats the way to "STACK" massacre missions and how to complete them quickly with a full Wing - Even high Target Massacres of 80 that payour $40+ Million can be seriouslly reduced to an effective 20 targets when done properly... and remember that will also tally for other contracts to other factions... so now you can see how you can be effective in policing authority in a given sector.


The Method
1. Take only one WING massacre mission from each Faction
2. Look at the Max Target ( the highest targe value ) and pad out the rest of you Massacre missions accordingly
3. Tag each others Targets
4. Only share when ready to Complete and Hand in

*A. Choose all the massacre missions in the same system -
interdictions also count for massacre targets if the same Pirate Faction.
*B. Mission Payouts will vary -
As they are dependent on Combat Rank and your Reputaion with the Faction that you made contract with.


________________________________________________________________

So some notes to make things more profitable -

1. Insure your Wing Mates improve their reputation ( Preferably to Allied ) with the faction mission givers of the system
2. All choose the same pirate clan to massacre in the SAME system
3. Ensure you are in the same "mission instance", not at another threat target as you wont get KILL ASSISTS or additional Wing Kills.

Best systems for this are Independent Systems where there is a lot of Mining Actiuvity - don't be afraide to buy your way into the graces of Factions to get better Mission Payouts - so pony up your Space Credits in dontations to get to Allied Status Quickly.

You and your WING can also do missions with REP+++ instead of max-credit payouts - to boost the standing with the local factions.

I primarily work from Cernan Dock in the GCRV 1568 System and there are so many Massacre Missions for Pikum Family Pirates - alternatively there is Shargin Station in the BD-21 4791 System.

Both systems also have conflict zones and HazRes sites so you can always use these as a source of vict.... err I mean Pirates you need to bring to justice.
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Re: hot Wings

Postby Zetr0 » Tue Mar 02, 2021 12:35 pm

Per asper ad astra -

Then "may the galaxy spin in your favour"

I hope the info that helps Commander -o7-
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Re: hot Wings

Postby M00N-WATCHER » Tue Mar 02, 2021 6:35 pm

@Zetr0

Wow! First, let me thank you for taking the time and your offer.

Give me a few minutes with all the new info and I'll get back to you with a proper response.

o7 Sir, o7
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Re: hot Wings

Postby M00N-WATCHER » Wed Mar 03, 2021 4:01 am

@Zetr0

Alright! Finally made it home from work. Longest day ever.

Thanks again for taking the time to reply.

I'm about 2 weeks into the game. I've spent the last week following a Road-to-Riches route, planet hopping, DSing, FSSing, DSSing. After an entire week's work, I got $30mil payout. Not bad to start. Ended up spending almost half of that on an AspX, bunch of upgrades and a couple of guns (which I never use. I'm going to remove them soon): 2B Seeking Missile Rack and 2D Laser Beam. No idea if they are any good, expensive though.

I know I'm not set up for a fight. I'm going to log on soon and use whatever money I have left to purchase a Viper IV, probably move the two guns I have on the AspX to the Viper, and a few upgrades. I have about $18mil left. What would you recommend, or believe are required from me, in order for us to Wing up?

I was able to stack a total of 20 Wing Commodity Missions just over a week ago for a Payout of $959,000.000 credits for each Wing Member - my Wing mates also had Wing Cash-In around the $450,000,000 to $750,000,000


Holysh** dude! Seriously??? That's unreal! When ready, you think we'd be able to hit those numbers? Also, bare in mind, I'm only 2 weeks old here, and only combat experience I have is from the tutorial.

Firstly add me to your in-game friends list CMDR "ZETERON" once you have that whenever we play in the same game mode "Open or Mobius PVE *private group" we can WING up


I will do this as soon as I log in next, later this evening. Awesome! My first friend!

Squadrons are not the same


Ah! This makes perfect sense. I had no idea of the difference.

At this point I will say, sign up to INARA


I use the site quite regularly. Never opened an account though. What are the benefits there? I have EDDiscovery, EDSM and EDDI installed on my PC, but they are a bit overwhelming and still haven't found how to utilize them properly. I think maybe I need to get more comfortable with the game itself before introducing all the other third party software.

Short Answer, yes there is money to be had here, but if you do not have an Engineered Ship, with Engineered Weapons and Shields - this wont come easy, even in a Wing.


Noted. I'm not nearly proficient enough for that even if I had an engineered ship. The pirating stuff will have to come later. For now, sounds like Commodity Sourcing might be the best way to start. You agree?

I often use, and would humbly recommend Discord for this, you can start your own or join an established channel and share that with your new Wing Mates. trust me this will save a lot of frustration and confusion down the line.


I've never used Discord before. Is this your preferred way of communication? If so, I will sign up for it and join whatever you think will be beneficial for us Winging up.

Do I need to fly to your location first?

So now, the prep. Thanks for your help with this!

I'm new to the game. I'm new to online gaming in general. Until Elite Dangerous. Now I'm hooked. I'm ready and willing to learn and get good. I welcome anyone to add me as friend. I just opened a Discord account: m00n-watcher#7922
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Re: hot Wings

Postby Zetr0 » Wed Mar 03, 2021 11:44 am

Greetings Commander Moon-Watcher -o7-

My sincere apologies for the HUGE WALL of text above ( and probably below when I finish typing ), I may have got carried away O_o

Added you to Discord, and will in-game when I log-in, there is a Commander meet tonight at 19:00 ED time, everyone is welcome, don't worry if you cannot phyiscally make it you can always drop in the the Discord when you do and perhaps join us in one of our ships via Multi Crew - we are unlocking the Guardian SLF tonight - (SLF = Ship Launched Fighter) so you can see how that is done ( PS, never done it before will be hitting up youtubes like a pro later ) - infact you can jump on of my SLF's and zap some guadian stuff - its fun and healthy I promise.

I will invite you to our discord channel so you can get to hear and join in with fellow Commanders and get a feel for the group - share some experiences have a good chuckle, pick on Commander Logic_me a little bit too ;)

Cash Payouts
Yes its very real - you can look at my Commander on INARA - look at the Cash flow for the 15th of Feb it jumps up to +1,987,513,322 and a further +987,780,363 on the 16th --- swiftly met with a -5,254,317,470 in the 17th ( Fleet Carrier Purchase )

Being a New Commander - means your mission payouts will be low for the ones that you can take - you will over time build a reputation in a system ( of your choosing ) and start getting good mission payouts -

There is a lot of information to pick up - Elite has vertical line instead of a curve for learning. However as I said to the group a couple of nights ago while were were wrestling Pirates and bringing them to jeee---- Justice - that my method of Play, Knowledge and Enjoyment has become all the much better and richer since Logic_Me started the Commnader Meet ups.

And now I get the share the vastness of the Cosmos and get to have some amazing stories from it - Just ask Commander Logic_Me about Anaconda Gravity Pancakes or myself about the Neutron BBQ Super Highway ( please wait till I finish Therapy though )

Third Party Tools
The problem with most Third Party Tools for new Commanders - initially they are quite confusing - but with time and play they will begin to make sense - With INARA its all web-based and you can if you wish LINK it to your ED account - I have INARA mainly to review my Character - see what Engineers I need to unlock, where and how to unlock them - where to find specific commodoties, services, modules or trade opportunites that are local to my current system - also I get to look at my awards and check on community goals then Gloat when I am in the top 10% and then blame worm-holes and white dwarfs when I am not - personally I find it really improves my game - as it also has blue-print list - I can review my current Materials that I have and see what I need to get for upgrades etc etc..

However it is emense and there is so much to learn about the game before any of that makes sense with 3rd Party tools -

"Fear not Neo, the Answers are Comming..."

Here is my current Tabbed Browser when I play Elite

1. Mobious PVE
2. Imgur
3. INARA
4. Coriolis
5. Mining Tool ( edtools.ddns.net )
6. EDDB.io ( awesome Stations, Systems, just great for quick searching commodity runs )
7. Neutron Plotter ( Spanish.co.uk)
8. Carrier Route Plotter ( Spanish.co.uk )
9. Raw Material finder ( Spanish.co.uk )

Honerable Mentions
ED Discovery ( handy logging tool - good for marking and blocking Gankers from your instance)
ED Engineer ( like a Stand Alone Coriolis - but for your current builds )


The Elite Career -
I do believe that every commanders Career is unique within Elite and its those experiences that shape us as Commanders - what we are good at and what we try to improve within the 'Elite verse as a whole, all to oftern I hear and I have used the term a Mile Wide and an Inch Deep when mentioning Elite to friends, but there is so much more when you have the Play Time to see it.

For me there is more than Credits and Carriers and Combat, there is the BGS and Squadrons I want to take part - in, Community Goals that also feed into a Narative. this is where the Game really shines. Sadly when I originally got the game I didn't see it.

Initially I got the game many MANY moons ago and played about maybe 35 hours - then I just got into other things and didn't play for quite some time - a good few of them years, I had less than $60,000,000 when I stopped playing, I had an ASPX and an Anaconda ( neither A rated or Engineered ) - I started to get back into Elite around October last Year- got a cheap £5 bargin version of Horizons and the difference in game is like Night and Day - had this been rolled out ( as it should of been at the start ) it would of kept me in the game.

Anyhoo that aside..

I recently started an Alternate Account - There was a Give-Away of Elite Dangerous+Horizons with the Epic Games Store, so I nabbed a copy - I had never seen the new-commander area and was very curious.

I limited my play-time of that account to 4 hours a week, I think I went over once (put 6 hours in) as I had dinner in between. Besides I was this close >.< to getting a Glorius Python and everyone knows when you get the Python you instantly WIN in Elite - its in the Rules and Disclaimer I am sure ;)

Over the last 3 weeks I have gone from a starting Sidewinder to the following

$122,000,000 Credit Cash Flow

D Rated T9 [ 256t cargo + Fighterbay + Surface Mining + regret as it lumbers sooo slow.....] - next play session i am getting a 'Conda
A/D Rated Python [ 256t Cargo + pew pew ] - A Glorius Machine!
A Rated T7 [ 300t Cargo + a blue light for a shield ]
A Rated AspX [ 120t + Good Jump range ]
A Rated T6 [ 100t Cargo + another blue light for a shield ] - impressive Yaw / Rol / Pitch rates on this little mosnter
A Rated Cobra Mk3 [ 2D pew pew + 1D pew pew ] -

* sadly the Cobra Mk3 is lacking in combat when it is not Engineered - to be fair it might also be my lack of skill

Obviously I have nothing Engineered just the base Rated Module Classes - I acheived the above with careful choice of missions and commodity sourcing - once I got to the Python I fitted this for Surface *laser* mining - found a Platinum Hot Spot and started earning a good $60,000,000 an hour just selling this at a station some 25 Light Years away - sadly 128tons cargo is not enough ( it is but I am greedy ) and the next ship with a capacity for 256t and mining is the T9 - I loath this lumber-bus... but money is money and its only for a couple of sessions if platinum prices hold ( currently $264,600 per Ton as of 33070222 - full hold worth $67,000,00 a trip ;) )

The above shows the difference in play and accumilation when a Commander has a good comprehension of ( re: hours in ) Elite and more so how to use 3rd Party Tools effectively.

To be fair though, I am always that kinda of player that makes notes in note-books and has a scientific calculator to hand...

Theres lots to do - I Look forward to seeing you out here in the black Commander -o7-
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Re: hot Wings

Postby M00N-WATCHER » Thu Mar 04, 2021 7:09 pm

Zetr0 wrote:Greetings Commander Moon-Watcher -o7-

My sincere apologies for the HUGE WALL of text above ( and probably below when I finish typing ), I may have got carried away O_o

.. -o7-



Thanks for the great info and my first PvE session with you guys. It was a blast and now I'm more hooked than ever.

Based on your recommendations and our discussions, I think commodity sourcing will be my next money-making venture. As I'm sure you know, as fun as Road-to-Riches is, the payout is quite painfully low. Got to work on those multipliers.
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Re: hot Wings

Postby Zetr0 » Fri Mar 05, 2021 3:14 am

Greetings Commander -o7-

It certainly was fun, sorry for throwing you out there in the deep-end with the Guardian ruins etc.....

The Fleet Carrier "Pax Magellanic" has completed its jump to Pikum in the bubble - about 10 light years from GCRV 1568 - so get out there and fire off them thrusters - the PAX is not going anywhere soon ( lol I need to do a refuel run ) so make her your base of oppertations if thats convienent for you.

If you are about later today ( 20210305 ) I will help you get some much needed cash-flow =)
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