The Nature of Artificial Intelligence

Not related at all to the game or group
User avatar
Draco84oz
Harmless
Harmless
Posts: 11
Joined: Tue Nov 01, 2016 10:22 am
CMDR: Draco84oz
CMDR_Platform: None Specified
Contact:

The Nature of Artificial Intelligence

Postby Draco84oz » Mon Jul 03, 2017 10:53 am

Please note that this is not supposed to be a debate on the ethical or moral questions surrounding AI (personally, I subscribe to the Azimov model as being preferred), but more a question as to what AI actually is.

So yes - what do you guys think Artifical Intelligence actually is - or what the term stands for.

I'm a big fan of sci-fi. I've read everything from H.G. Wells to Issac Azimov to Anne McCaffrey, from The Forever War to The Martian, and will probably be looking for a set of The Leviathan Wakes soon enough. And in each of these, there is usually some form of robot or computer that assists the characters. Now, most of the time, this computer is generally a form of Artificial Intelligence - although the exact details vary from title to title, they generally are able to learn, make intuitive leaps, and also form whatever sort of Deus Ex Machina the author wants it to be at the time.

But in the real world, I read discussions about AI all the time - an I'm beginning to think that the term is losing much of its impact - kinda how the term "life" has progressed from being actually walking humanoids at the start of the 20th Century, to NASA saying that any form of biological reaction on a planetary surface (i.e. bacteria) is "life".

Take video games for example (relevent, I know...). Generally speaking, the term "game AI" usually refers to the behaviors of the various NPCs, their combat cycles etc. But, can this really be called Artifical Intelligence? Isn't it technically more a case of a very complicated decision tree? One of the things that defines modern MMO raiding is that the bosses and enemies all follow predictable patterns - they don't jump phases, they don't suddenly do some new kind of attack out of the blue.

And also the modern world. On our national news website today, there was an article about how AI will "reshape our lives". But even in that article, it seems to confuse Artifical Intelligence with algorthims and automation.

Perhaps its just the sci-fi nut in me getting angry with others seeming to degrade the nature of an interesting term in my view.

But what do you guys think? Is the term getting degraded/undermined? Or are we just refining what the term means?
Image

User avatar
Orochimaru
Expert
Expert
Posts: 298
Joined: Wed May 03, 2017 6:17 am
CMDR: Orochimaruh
CMDR_Platform: None Specified
Contact:

Re: The Nature of Artificial Intelligence

Postby Orochimaru » Mon Jul 03, 2017 11:38 am

For a concise definition, I believe you have to go to the source: Alan Turing.
He wrote many articles on the subject of thinking machines. I recommend two: "Can Digital Computers Think?" and "Intelligent Machinery, A Heretical Theory".

A definition by Jack Copeland: "Artificial Intelligence (AI) is usually defined as the science of making computers do things that require intelligence when done by humans."

More info here.
http://www.alanturing.net/turing_archiv ... %20ai.html

Hope this helps CMDR o7
//"ye meet orochi crazy ass vulture pilot" ^^

User avatar
Draco84oz
Harmless
Harmless
Posts: 11
Joined: Tue Nov 01, 2016 10:22 am
CMDR: Draco84oz
CMDR_Platform: None Specified
Contact:

Re: The Nature of Artificial Intelligence

Postby Draco84oz » Tue Jul 04, 2017 3:34 am

Are you referring to the Turing test? Because didn't someone develop a program complex enough to pass that a couple of years ago?
Image

User avatar
Relix Typhon
Master
Master
Posts: 779
Joined: Thu Aug 25, 2016 1:08 pm
CMDR: Relix Typhon
CMDR_Platform: None Specified
Contact:

Re: The Nature of Artificial Intelligence

Postby Relix Typhon » Tue Jul 04, 2017 8:51 am

I don't think we have the capability to make a true AI yet, nor will we ever with classical computing.
As for definition, I just think that anything that is slightly perceived to think for itself is now coming under the umbrella term. It happens. Its easier than saying "a very complicated decision tree".

Now life, that is interesting. Give this video a watch, its amazing.

TorTorden
Deadly
Deadly
Posts: 4021
Joined: Mon Jun 01, 2015 11:13 am
CMDR: TorTorden
CMDR_Platform: None Specified
Contact:

Re: The Nature of Artificial Intelligence

Postby TorTorden » Tue Jul 04, 2017 9:33 am

RD-83 wrote:As for definition, I just think that anything that is slightly perceived to think for itself is now coming under the umbrella term. It happens. Its easier than saying "a very complicated decision tree".
.

Certainly more catchwordy. And as for learning.
It could be as simple as when the program has multiple options it can go "option b has given better metrics in the past".
Image

Hey I'm Thor -
People call me Bob.

Rule 1: Pillage. Then burn.
Rule 2: No such thing as overkill, as long as there are reloads.

User avatar
Roger Wilco Jr
Master
Master
Posts: 1811
Joined: Sat Nov 22, 2014 3:52 pm
CMDR: Roger Wilco Jr.
CMDR_Platform: None Specified
Contact:

Re: The Nature of Artificial Intelligence

Postby Roger Wilco Jr » Wed Jul 05, 2017 12:04 am

I think it's fair to say the NPCs in ED have an "artificial intelligence" about their actions and reactions, as compared to the trucks driving in loops inside stations. If they weren't supposed to be human pilots, then you could just say they were robotic ships w/o mentioning AI at all. I suppose you could call them simulated human characters with limited programming decision trees, but AI is just so much easier than SHCLPDs. :roll:

It also seems that I've heard a lot of dire predictions about AI in the future, and I don't believe a word of it. I'm sure there will be some "smart" computers, and I suppose Deep Blue (or whatever it's called) is already there, but I don't see it or future computers taking over the world and "breeding" and exterminating the humans ...

As for life, I've always though of any thing like animals, plants, bacteria to be living. But something like organic chemicals, no, not really. Not that I'd give 2-cents about protecting bacteria on another planet, or even on this planet (that goes for cockroaches too).
It's time to give this another go.

TorTorden
Deadly
Deadly
Posts: 4021
Joined: Mon Jun 01, 2015 11:13 am
CMDR: TorTorden
CMDR_Platform: None Specified
Contact:

Re: The Nature of Artificial Intelligence

Postby TorTorden » Wed Jul 05, 2017 11:32 am

Roger Wilco Jr wrote:I think it's fair to say the NPCs in ED have an "artificial intelligence" about their actions and reactions, as compared to the trucks driving in loops inside stations. If they weren't supposed to be human pilots, then you could just say they were robotic ships w/o mentioning AI at all. I suppose you could call them simulated human characters with limited programming decision trees, but AI is just so much easier than SHCLPDs. :roll:

It also seems that I've heard a lot of dire predictions about AI in the future, and I don't believe a word of it. I'm sure there will be some "smart" computers, and I suppose Deep Blue (or whatever it's called) is already there, but I don't see it or future computers taking over the world and "breeding" and exterminating the humans ...

As for life, I've always though of any thing like animals, plants, bacteria to be living. But something like organic chemicals, no, not really. Not that I'd give 2-cents about protecting bacteria on another planet, or even on this planet (that goes for cockroaches too).


But video game AI, or better yet, Hostile NPC's aren't AI, they are behaviour scripts without any learning capability, and this learning capability is the crucial point for intelligence, as in it can be trained instead of programmed, regardles of it being natural or artificial.
The pet\avatar thing in Black & white was probably something rather close to it if we think of video game examples.
Only way an npc in Elite changes behaviour is if the programmer changes the program, so no AI.

The place where AI would most benefit this game however would be in the BGS, if the BGS could have some AI based sanity checks on system expansion or other mission generation, this game would make a whole new kind of sense.

As for AI in general, some of my favourite fiction examples has to be the Tank spiders from the Ghost in the shell, the animated Tv series that is.
I especially loved it's take on god (God is in the zero\void), pseudo immortality (It's not alive so technically it can't die), and how 'it' as a dfigital being could never gain a soul, regardless if it would aquire biological parts.
As with humans could never truly loose their humanity regardless of how many digital\mechanical components they add on through cyberization.

Simplistic, yes, but also quite surprising to come from a cartoon, even Japanese ones especially when in western culture AI in fiction is predetermined like Chekov's gun to be "AI = Skynet", or at best HAL.
A friendly, non murderous, and compassionate AI. As far as Hollywood is concerned is utterly impossible.

I don't really know if I'm just rambling here, I'm honestly writing this mostly to break in my new keyboard.
It's either this or touch typing exercices..
Image

Hey I'm Thor -
People call me Bob.

Rule 1: Pillage. Then burn.
Rule 2: No such thing as overkill, as long as there are reloads.


Return to “Off-Topic”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 22 guests

i